# Struggle with Lift foils
**URL:** https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848
**Category:** Uncategorized
**Created:** [December 5, 2024, 3:26am UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848 "2024-12-05T03:26:15Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 3:26am UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/1 "2024-12-05T03:26:15Z")
Can wing foil easily on my old lo aspect Cabrinha varial, SAB 945, SAB Balz pro 909, Armstrong 1200 but everything seems backwards on the Lift Surf 150V2 or 170 HA. Have them all the way forward in the box with a little front shim and it’s better but still wants to nose dive on jibes or get squirrelly if not firmly rail pressured. Seems to demand a lot of back foot pressure to keep the level flight. Is this me or the foil?
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### Author:  [@Hdip](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Hdip)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 4:58am UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/2 "2024-12-05T04:58:24Z")
Your boxes are probably too far back for lift foils. What board?
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:03am UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/3 "2024-12-05T05:03:46Z")
A North seek 78 L ,short tombstone style and a SAB millet hybrid 95 L. Much more difficult to ride than any other foil.
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:29am UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/4 "2024-12-05T05:29:55Z")
Mid length torpedo SAB, with a long box
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### Author:  [@ScarlessFoils](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/ScarlessFoils)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 1:42pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/5 "2024-12-05T13:42:30Z")
> [@Hdip](#):
>
> Your boxes are probably too far back for lift foils
Something that you can try is standing further back in the board. Yo may have to go strapless but at least you can feel the foil attitude change and issolate the issue.
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 2:20pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/6 "2024-12-05T14:20:11Z")
I only ride strapless. Thnx
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### Author:  [@Kezia](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Kezia)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/7 "2024-12-05T15:46:18Z")
Hey Paracas !
Lift requires to be very much in the front of the boxes compared to most brands.
Many also likes a 0.5 or 1 degree nose-up plate shim.
What tail are you using ? Some, like the carve line, are very sensitives.
If you are looking for stability, you can go for a FoilParts long fuselage ; I still use them with KD Marlin tail when I just want to sail around.
With Lift tails you should be ok with the Glide line to start.
The Surf 150V2 is a very surf oriented wing, I’m not surprised you find it hard.
About the 170HA, note that the Sabfoil 945 should compare with Lift 200HA ; and the Balz Pro 909, even if it has a relatively small surface has a lot of power, much more than the 170HA.
No clue about the Armstrong.
And finally, even if I love Lift (that’s what I ride, and I’ve had many others foils) I reckon that they are not the best foils for just sailing. For surfing and downwinding (eventually with a wing) they are super good, but for sailing… meh !
I don’t wing that much so it’s ok for me ; but if I was only winging (especially on flat water) I’d go with another brand like Sabfoil much more balanced for that purpose.
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 4:52pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/8 "2024-12-05T16:52:37Z")
I have both a 25 and 33 tail. Mostly using the 33. Even with an extension on I found it too sensitive. Worked better with a small(credit card) shim but may try to buy an actual board shim before I give up on Lift all together . Any suggestions for a shim supplier?
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 4:54pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/9 "2024-12-05T16:54:27Z")
PS I only wing. I wonder if these foils are designed to be used with a prop hence the nose down when powered from above rather than below?
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### Author:  [@Hdip](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Hdip)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:05pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/10 "2024-12-05T17:05:15Z")
> **[Downloads | Code Foils](https://codefoils.com/support/downloads/)**
>
> Code Foils Downloads Tail Shims, Collated Sizes Download .stp file Download .stl file Use your 3D printer to make your own Code Foils tail shims. This file ...
If you have access to a 3d printer you can print your own baseplate shim using a file from Code. If you want to buy one KT sells one. Here’s a link from the foil shop in Seal Beach, CA.
> **[KT Baseplate to Board Shim 1°](https://foilshop.com/products/kt-mast-plate-to-board-shim-1?srsltid=AfmBOopEoHOITqF6TYT8aLMI81muly77XcZoeenB7GQhy4loyWjyk35v)**
>
> PRE-ORDER Should ship by October 30th Low Profile Streamlined Shape: Reduces drag and enhances overall performance. Seamless Integration with Shim: Easily insert baseplate shims from either side to adjust the board angle rela-tive to...
EDIT: I started prone and now mainly wing. I used to love the surf 150v2 on the wing for lighter wind and the ha90 for mid-stronger wind. Lift foils are more pitch sensitive than others. Some people say they’re like riding a rocking horse. I never baseplate shimmed them personally.
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:13pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/11 "2024-12-05T17:13:50Z")
Thnx all. Dont have access to 3D printer
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### Author:  [@Stealthgrind](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Stealthgrind)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:26pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/12 "2024-12-05T17:26:04Z")
I drilled a couple holes in a cheap plastic putty knife from lowes, that made a pretty good shim.
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### Author:  [@Eriefoiler](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Eriefoiler)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:26pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/13 "2024-12-05T17:26:21Z")
Depends on the tailwing. Glide tails are def more prop orientated, flow and carve have more angle built in. In general though, more nose down means less tail drag, and therefore more efficiency.
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### Author:  [@Stealthgrind](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Stealthgrind)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:40pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/14 "2024-12-05T17:40:30Z")
The tail makes a big difference. Using a foil drive I was struggling a lot with not having enough backfoot pressure on a 25 glide due to the forward stance required while motoring.
Switching to a short fuse carve tail which also has more front foot pressure made a big difference
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:50pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/15 "2024-12-05T17:50:30Z")
I think the 33 is a Glide and the 25, Carve.
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### Author:  [@Stealthgrind](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Stealthgrind)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:52pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/16 "2024-12-05T17:52:05Z")
Glide comes in 25 and 32, maybe something bigger.
Carve is 20, 26, and… maybe that 33?
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 6:35pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/17 "2024-12-05T18:35:04Z")
The foils are in Peru so working off aging memory
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### Author:  [@Paracas](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Paracas)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 6:39pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/18 "2024-12-05T18:39:55Z")
Interesting work around
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### Author:  [@Eriefoiler](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/Eriefoiler)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 6:51pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/19 "2024-12-05T18:51:17Z")
Both of these are glide tails and therefore fairly pitch unstable
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### Author:  [@sailandfish](https://forum.progressionproject.com/u/sailandfish)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://forum.progressionproject.com/t/struggle-with-lift-foils/7848/20 "2024-12-05T21:31:13Z")
Recommend trying the carve or flow back wings, and stay away from the glides.
I found the 25 Glide unrideable while winging. The 26 carve + extension was by comparison very chill and enjoyable. The flow allows faster speed and better glide vs the carve. I’ve progressed to the Florence tail and found it to be a happy medium between speed and twitchy.
Lift rides with rear foot pressure which is opposite many other systems, and definitely opposite Cab.
As you accelerate it requires more rear foot pressure, which is counterintuitive. Failing to add rear foot pressure results in nosediving. The foils also load up in turns, hence why you are nosediving while gybing, again need more rear foot pressure. If you are dropping into a wave you may need to take a step back to get the proper rear foot pressure.
They are definitely more twitchy than some of the brands. But, changing tails can change that experience.
I had a favorite GoFoil board for winging. It was incompatible with Lift, and I had to get a different board. Just couldn’t position mast vs feet to ride it.
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