Are you still paddle DW after parawinging?

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For those of you that used to SUP downwind with a paddle and have started parawinging, have you stopped paddling once you’ve began parawinging?

Only real benefit I see to paddling (without having done either) is if the wind dies down and you can’t get up on foil with the parawing. But apart from that, I see mostly advantages to parawinging (going upwind, being able to get out to the bumps easier, smaller board and smaller foil, not as exhausting, HANDS FREE…)

I might be wrong and would like to know your opinions!

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Yes sold the big board. Mostly due to the crew either foil driving or parawinging instead of sup.

I had this, closest I’ve come to needing a rescue on a big downwinder in December, coudn’t get on foil, started to get cold. Pretty miserable experience. Thankfully wind picked up and a parasailed the entire latter half of the run.

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I guess it really depends on the distance to shore, but plain prone paddling is an option. Also, how much wind do you need to slowly parasail? I would expect really light winds (6 knots maybe?) to be effective enough at least to drift downwards.

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Parawing has made me put my paddle away 90 percent of the time. In super light wind or longer open ocean runs like 15+ miles I would still choose a paddle for safety and confidence

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It’s a mixed bag…

SUPfoil is the only way to ride waves all winter to avoid crowds and kelp so I maintain my paddle power all year - so it’s not a big deal to paddle for me.

In the summer it is a lifeline to finishing runs where the wind dies. Yesterday we had +20 knots and big bumps, hit 25+mph on the 24 mile DW. Wind absolutely died at the end. Aced the run on the parawing and 6’ board so only used it for 30s at the start, but would have been in trouble had I fallen. It’s too easy to ride far into lulls only to realize there is no deploying at that point.

I have a 7’2” dw/parawing board I can paddle up I will ride more. Ordered a 3 piece black project custom paddle I plan on having stowed for wind dying eventualities. Basically ride a hybrid board and bring a stowed paddle on PW runs, and bring a PW on paddle runs. Now I’m a hybrid :roll_eyes: .

If I was a mid paddler I would for sure give it up and adjust my riding to be more cautious (don’t go far offshore, head to the beach if the wind drops), but currently it’s actually easier for me to paddle then parawing, no tangles, pop up on the first or second go, no cares about the wind dying. Case in point, yesterday my bud SUP’d the run and I was faffing with my parawing in the lee of a point he just paddled to the wind line and actually got going before me.

Main issue is that riding a small board is more fun and PW makes the first 10 minutes better by not needing to paddle offshore, and sometimes the last 10m better by allowing me to keep a straighter line offshore then 90 degree reaching straight in to the beach whereas with the paddle I have to head in sooner into the crap bumps and hit a PR on my heart rate, haha. If I’m going with people I have to babysit I can do that with the parawing.

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In practice yes, in this whole windy season I have mostly used the parawing, only a couple times I’ve gone with the SUP, and mainly for just spicing things up and not losing that feeling.

But logically, from whatever point of view in my cases I see it, parawing wins as weapon of choice

My DW run starts at en open point where I need to paddle for 15 to 20 minutes, with the parawing it’s a bit less time, one leg up wing and less effort most cases.

My “easy” day to day DW run it’s geography limited to 8K, with the PW I can extend that with laps at the end of the run where there’s also good waves for either wave shore riding or a bit more open swell/wind bumps which are fun as well, so I can extend the fun of all the shuttle logistics which with the sup it’s usually just a 25-35 minutes run, I can do a more than an hour mixed DW/surf sesh.

If I want to go for a longer run, then I’m obligated to do a 30-35K run which in SUP can be really extenuating and more risky since there’s some tricky parts with crossed currents that make paddling up a nightmare no matter the conditions. I’ve done it successfuly with the SUP before PW was a thing, but now I just go for the parawing to go for a safer bet.

Gotta make a clarification here, in our windy season, wind is very reliable thru the whole day and whenever you go out expecting 20+ knots worst case scenario is 15 knots (which I can’t take off on 3m), but instead of a paddle I’ve been using a second parawing well and small packed 4.3m so it’s my safety insurance, this I know it’s not so trusty on some more inconsistent spots, works for me and have been need to be used in couple cases letting me just do my run no issues and having fun.

Still, I’m not getting completely out of SUP DW, it’s the core, it’s hardcore, it’s hard, so it’s still appealing for me, and for some runs I still want to choose it sometimes just for fun and keeping thing’s spicy.

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Parawing ain’t gonna help me get on foil when the wind dies. The paddle offers so much security for making longer runs in variable conditions. Ie) the waves stay up for a bit when conditions change.

Both have a place in my quiver. But for long runs on the great lakes I will gravitate to a paddle everytime

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Yeap totally.

That’s why I mentioned we get really consistent winds when in windy season, 20-25 knots everyday almost all day around. If there’s any chance of a drop in wind on the forecast I’m just not going out for any downwind, it’s probably better just to stay on shore and do prone foiling :slight_smile: .

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I am 59yo and sold all my SUP DW boards. I am not a legend SUP DW foiler but competent enough to enjoy it and ride for 10k non stop at a time.

I can’t think of a single reason to DW with a paddle for me.

The argument that if the wind was 20 knots but dies during a SUP DW the paddle will get me home doesn’t stack up to reality. If i size my foil to enjoy a 20 knot run then i am not going to be paddling up when the wind dies nor am i going to be able to stay on foil for very long without exhaustion. Then I am faced with prone paddle in to shore somewhere on an 8’6” SUP. In the same circumstances i can still just paddle my 6’ PW board to shore, a little slower, but same result really and easier to navigate the surf on the PW board. The fact is i have had many times more bump sessions this year because I can choose where the wind will be good enough on days where the DW crew are not going because of the large variability in the conditions across the distance of the runs.

The difference with the PW is that i can ride bumps with a board and foil that allows a level of surfing close to prone. I can choose a section of a run about 5k long where the wind is very predictable and i just lap it till I can’t anymore. I don’t have to rely on anyone and I get to spend about 45klms on foil instead of 15ks and a long car ride. My bump reading skills have improved out of site because I am looking to turn so much on a short board with the goal of finishing the turns high on the mast in a good position to dive straight into the next carve. I am no longer just making safety choices like i have done for the last 4 years.

To me they are now completely different sports. SUP DW makes sense if you want to go fast and cover big distances as the momentum and stabilizing effect of the big board adds to performance. PW DW is all about surfing and I am a surfer after all.

Each to their own and I think they will both coexist but the numbers of PW’s will eventually outnumber SUP by an order of magnitude.

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The issue was that the wind dies as I went past the only early exit, so I tried for 10min to get on foil, then 10min of kneeling parawinging upwind towards exit in about 8kn of wind to see if I could make it back to the exit, at which point I started to get cold, and realised I was not making any ground upwind at all, and was going to have to prone paddle it, which was probably an hour or more as the contra tide accelerated.

4.3m Pocketrocket which has a large margin for error, but the wind went very light.

In December in 4*c weather with short days I was considering calling coastguard to let them know, which invariably leads to them coming out to check.

The bumps were reasonably good and would have been trivial to paddle up instantly, but I am pretty experienced with SUP

Thankfully the wind picked up, and I completed the second half of the run. Wind where I am is super shifty in winter. In summer it’s more reliable.

+1 to everything @johnnytsunami said, agree 100%. The paddle would be a very good buy, and I think vacuum bagging a 5m+ parawing as a second is a good alternative call.

I don’t have a board big enough to reliably SUP, I doubt I will, perhaps I won’t SUP again unless I end up living somewhere with better conditions

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I agree with this, and I think we are going to see MANY more rescues and likely more tragedies as this is for sure an “easy mode” to go beyond the horizon in the wild ocean. Not a forgiving place and I feel like the SUP route led to healthy respect for the process.

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I have more experience with SUP DW at this point, and am in early stages of parawing. I am still pretty challenged with dousing while staying up on smallish wind bumps. Way more success in bigger bumps. I think I’ll always be hybrid, though–some of my areas have current-influenced big bumps with minimal wind–this is a paddle situation. Other areas are perfect with the para regarding upwind ability and increasing the “riding radius”. I’m excited to try the parawing approach to position myself optimally for a sup run–haven’t tried that yet. All in all, I’m loving the versatility of having both, and aspire to some semblance of “grace” with the parawing. Long way from that now, though!

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In Hawaii there will always be “purist” and will only use the paddle. They train hard for the M2O and races. Then there’s guys or gals like me that are just doing it for fun, so i still bring my PW and paddle out there.

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Interesting topic. 100% hybrid here riding ocean trade wind bumps. Competent paddle starter always carrying a Brm Kaa. If race mode: only ride for first 5km out and packpack stow for paddle up. If carve mode under 20knots I ride the smallest board I can paddle up 6’0 77L not worried about riding way outside. Over 20knots is all in PW mode on ultra sinker 25 or 34L and Lift 120 redeploying for max turninh angles.

Made a clip about this thread in portuguese because of frequent questions about paddle + PW:

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I saw you’ve gone small on the board, looks really good? what is the paddle up situation? My current board is still long at 7’6 but closer to my weight than I’d like. Maybe the plan for the summer is getting to grips with smaller board paddle up to unlock the best of both worlds

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Great topic - we are trying to figure out whether to run another DW paddle race in our SF region given that our audience (of dedicated sup foilers) may have already peaked!

While it’s not clear how to score a PW in a DW race context, if you are optimizing for participation, you have to include PW and wing - many are just as happy to attend a boat-supported epic with the friendliness of Paddle Imua.

I too worry about folks under-estimating the risks of parawinging. Some have started to carry them as backups for offshore winging (and in some cases, have never taken it out of the package!).

After having sup-foiled M2O, I still have an affection for the paddle, but don’t see any reason to choose to paddle over parawing for regular cruising.

In almost every case I tell folks to just learn to parawing as the first step in downwinding, and they can switch to paddling at a future date if they so choose.

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Paddling up a midlength is a real pain but I struggled already before PW came out because I was seeking the ultimate sup dw and ordered a custom “mini sup”, as I called it a couple years ago. With a parawing I rarely need to paddle up but I do it once a run just to check the box.

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A lot of good points have already been mentioned—if the wind dies, self-rescue becomes important, and in marginal or uncertain forecasts paddling can still be the better option. Those are all very real considerations.

For me though, it’s also about rounding out my abilities. Paddling makes me a better overall waterman. It’s similar to the comparison between Foil Drive and prone foiling—I enjoy both and want to be competent at both so I can choose the right tool for the conditions.

I also really value the athletic side of paddle downwinding. It took time to build the skill and strength to do it well, and that process is part of the reward. There’s something satisfying about earning those glides purely through paddling.

For people who jumped straight into parawinging without ever learning to paddle downwind, I honestly think they’re missing out on a big part of the experience.

For me it’s not one or the other—it’s just having more tools and more ways to enjoy the ocean.

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Yes I would say paddle downwind was certainly the most frustrating thing I’ve done and also the most incredible when it came together eventually

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