This may be addressed in another thread but I’m not finding it. If so please point the way.
My question is whether it is worth getting a DW style board for light wind PW?
I have a 65 ltr Hydrocraft ATV which is great for decent conditions – and of late have been getting a lot of ocean sessions with it (Outer Banks, NC). But there are days where the ocean is not happening and I just want to mow the lawn in the sound and work on transitions, feet switches or go cruising. This would be for days with wind in the 12-20 range, my biggest wing is a 4.0 Pyro. I weigh 74 KG and am thinking a 7-8’ DW board (100-110 ltr) would work. As a bonus I could use it for SUP on small wave ocean days.
Are many of you making good use of a DW board for this type of use case?
I have the hydrocraft 80l gunboat and weigh 75 kg. For me it’s a good light wind parawing board and i feel no need for a bigger one. my biggest parawing is a frigate 5.5 though, and on those light wind days i bolt a code 1250r on the board.
I think it is. Your 65L board to your weight means you need a bit of power to get going. I have a 60L to my 63Kg and while it’s awesome once up, I find it skews the parawing size such that I more often ride my Dragonfly 7’x19"x100L and can get up using crazy small parawings for the conditions. If it’s light, or gusty, this is a really big advantage such that I really don’t use my smaller board very often at all. There’s not much downside to the bigger board in my opinion, other than the nose in the lines as ilboarder mentions. I think you’d appreciate owning a DW board.
+1 I only ride a DW board for PW and if I could do one thing it would be to snub nose it. At 7’6 it seems to want to get involved. V1 ozone so might be less of an issue on shorter lines
worth it. though not sure you need a 110L board. 100L is more than sufficient as long as it has enough length imho. but it all depends on how much low end you need. a 7’5 board with 90L + of volume will take you deep into the light wind window as long as you switch up the foil. if not, then just get a longer board with more volume to compensate.
I hate my 7’8 110l dw board for parawinging, it rides so much worse than my 85l midlength and is barely easier to get on foil. If you want to SUP as well it might make sense, but if only for parawinging I don’t think it is worth going more than 20l+.
If considering buying a new board and you’re also gonna sup DW in it, then yes
If only getting it for PW in LightWind, then it’s not worth it, just get 15-20L + your weight on a midlenght shape, a DW long board would be a bit better for generation of speed and early start, but precisely in light winds lines tent to loose tension and that’s when the so mentioned nose issue comes into play.
New Midlenght shapes are more focused for parawing and even sup surf or advanced sup DW.
I think we are all not really in too much disagreement, just the options aren’t clearly defined. If it’s DW board vs. -10L board I think the DW makes sense. If it’s DW vs +20L midlength I think it’s less clear and I’d probably go with the midlength.
I currently have a 60L SuperK and a 100L v1 Dragonfly(only 7’ not the 8’ of a current DW board). I use the Dragonfly the most, but I have a 6’2" 75L Hydrocraft ATV on order which will be a +15L mid length with a flatter bottom and a bit more width than my other two boards. Right in between them lengthwise. To me this does seem like the best choice right now, shorter than a DW board, +10-20L volume, perhaps a bit of extra width and stability over a true DW board. When I demoed the ATV I was able to get up in extremely light conditions and didn’t need to use a large wing. I’m sure my Dragonfly has a small advantage there but not much, plus the stability meant I could pump up with much more confidence.
My take is that a pure DW SUP only makes sense if you plan to take on the SUP dw challenge. For parawing I see little to no benefit to having a board that is more than neutral in vol. A neutral mid length that is 20in wide or less will get going just as soon as a SUP DW board. Unless you are a top athlete you are going to want a big and stable dw board for sup. Usually +30 and quite long(8ft). I have one, and I hate it for PW. Much prefer my 6’4 90l mid, its not even close. I only hold onto the DW board because its not worth much any more and its a remaining skill ladder that I would like to climb ‘some day’.
I sold all my DW boards after parawinging on them a lot in the early phase of learning to parawing and my paddle just sits here now.
My experience is that at 65kg on an armstrong ML 75l i can pretty much get the same low end as my DW boards. I would be lying if i said it didn’t take more skill, technique and effort at 10 to 12 knots but is consistently possible.
I imagine there is a point somewhere around your weight in volume where this all becomes possible but i do think the length can’t be too short the closer you get to weight = volume
I don’t think you really need a DW board but having a +15-25L ML is 100% worth it.
DW boards are a bit more annoying when PW and they are a bit less pumpable than ML boards so I don’t really find them extending my person low end (but I do a lot of pumping).
This has been a fun one. Mowing the lawn in the sound is not as much fun as you would think because your foil mast is limited in length and the areas you can actually go are really limited by the sound’s water depth, especially when compared to non-foiling kiting and windsurfing. Doable, but not really that satisfying. I know you are a local and know the spots, as well as how wonderful oceanside runs are. Foilrat has a three board quiver that includes a DW board +20 liters (and I presume he paddles it occasionally) that he uses in said light conditions, but he is mostly using a custom Frank Boards at -5 liters, and -15 liters. I am sailing in marginal winds and flatter water a lot (not by choice) and am using my +18 liter DW board a lot more than I ever expected. Getting up on the bottom end of the wind range is way more satisfying than the limitation in riding a bigger board in light winds. If you still wing, it is not necessary, just wing (no shame) in those conditions. But if you want to avoid the bladder, I think the +20 liter DW (old school 19-20" width) is a great tool to make the most of those conditions.
65kg. I parawing 25L 34L 77L ML and 95L 7’8 SUP. Downwind only. Never jibe. Only one tack out and stashing.
I only take the 95L DW board with parawing and a paddle strapped for sup riding. I start the 77L with same wind as the 95L but different riding. DW board for straight fast and ML for carving dw. The other smaller I ride above 18 kn only
When I was learning to parawing I hated my downwind board. Constantly falling and getting the nose tangled in the lines was torture. Now that I am a lot more proficient I enjoy using the big board so I can size down to a smaller parawing. Using a 3m instead of a 4m is great.
I’m around 105kg, and my midlength everyday wing board was at -10L, which made it a bit harder than necessary initially to get on foil. And therefore quickly getting into overpowered/out of control territory. So I jumped on the opportunity to get a bigger board to make things easier in the low end. I went for an Armstrong DW 135L, which is probably a bit overkill, but hey, they don’t really make +15-20L midlengths for fatties… It de-facto creeps into DW SUP territory. And I thought I could use it with a paddle too, where the +30L is the recommended volume for “standard” people.
Since it’s a lightwind addition to the quiver, it’s good to have quite a bit of a difference with my everyday board, and having ample comfort and slogging stability is enjoyable, even with a wing when it’s light. That’s a lot of board for sure, but I’ve had good times on it, and still do. And even if technique gets refined and my overall low end improves, that board still takes off with less effort, and evens out the playfield with the light riders.
Probably the next size down would have worked just as well, with still plenty of stability for windsports, but sometimes you have to do with what appears on local market. There’s a place for it in the quiver.
Big board, big parawing or big foil, and combinations of those.
Big foils. I cannot comment much on those, some people seem to like them…i certainly don’t like anything with a span much bigger than 1000cm.
My solution at 72kg and riding small lake bumps is a ml in the 5’11 x 78l range (just switching to the kt arc from the uni 5’10 quiverkiller, but havent tried it yet) + a tripleseven 7.2 parawing (just got the ltx, will try in the next days, had the pt skin before) so i don’t have to go above 1100cm2 for my foil on those tiny bump days.
If you don’t want to substitute your smaller board with something more neutral and you will actually really supfoil (in waves not dw) the bigger board (i always planned on doing it with the 6’2 superK i had but never did it much) then i’d look at something in the 6’4 - 6’6 x 21-22’’ range with 90-100l. It will give you more lateral stability than the long dw boards and way easier handling, but still a lot better lowend than your small board…and will also still stay manageable when the wind picks up.
Because long dw boards are a pain in stronger winds with the pw. As mentioned above by other folks the nose annoyingly catches the lines all the time…but it also already accelerates while on your knees still and once up it is way harder to turn the nose upwind to slow down/lean against the pw in gusts, both slogging and on foil.