Yes, this is my theory as well. I’d say for being a budget brand the fit and finish was surprisingly good. The sirus xxl was also an easy foil to pump on. Only downside was the weight.
I’ve been thinking about how mast fuses are trending more cylindrical.
From my understanding, there are two reasons
1. Drag
This seems pretty straight forward.
I compared the circumference of Code vs AFS (ultra mono) at the front of the foot and it’s 14.5cm vs 11.5cm.
This is 26% penalty in skin friction drag due to larger surface area
An additional penalty in form drag because cross-sectional area is 25% bigger (punches a bigger hole through the water)
So some non-trivial amount.
2. Hard edges cause more turbulence
This was more interesting, and maybe more subtle. The first time I rode the code I could swear it felt more draggy, in a weird way. This will sound unlikely but like I could feel more turbulence. I haven’t ridden them back to back, but I wonder if I might have felt this.
An unquantified penalty from higher form drag due to turbulent wake. The square fuselages sharper corners will disturb the flow along it’s body.
I guess this plays into the conversation around what would work as a standard as it would need to cater to smaller and smaller fuse sizes
Agreed that the code fuses are bigger than the afs, but did you see the thread where the AFS guy broke two fuses because he was too heavy and/or the wing too big while pumping. Guess you need to design the fuse diameter for the biggest possible wing/rider weight, which seems kinda bad if you’re lightweight riding the tiny front wings. One thing I think that I notice is when riding the long code fuse compared to the short. I get a bit more low end from the long, but I swear that it feels noticeably more draggy. But you have pros who specifically ride the long fuse and larger tail wings and they go for an hour in the surf or pumping upwind. So I’m unsure if I need to put more time on the long fuse even though I don’t feel like I can pump it as efficiently vs the shorter ones
One benefit of having the front wing and fuse as a single piece is you can size the connection. Bigger for the large foils that see more load, smaller for the not so wide foils. Not sure if Code or anyone else actually does that though?
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Ya exactly what I was thinking. Most foils these days could go smaller fuse depending on the needs of the foil, the limiting factor for many like Code and Unifoil is the mast foot, Gong seems to have found a balance there with the v3. Fwiw the AFS fuselink feels bulkier than the mono equivalent.
Cool concept from Apple tree, this is the other end so needs it’s own thread if that becomes a thing
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I sense a new Cedrus adapter coming up
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Is this setup in partnership with Core? That board says Core and I think Appletree makes their boards.
Not sure.
Appletree does produce for other brands (Omen etc)
The launch partner is Core, but we have also been working with Appletree for months and made them some prototype mounts to test the system using a variety of foils. We’ve got one on display at our booth and the reception has been strong. We can confirm Ken was stoked and it was nice to talk to him. The Appletree team has been great to work with, and we’ve chatted with Core as well about some of the early lessons learned.
It’s a cool system, very clean, and will make board shapers and mast makers lives easier. We’re excited to offer this mount option when the design is finalized.
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Thanks Kyle. Very interested to hear from some board designers as to the benefits. Have to imagine the box reinforcement is substantial. As big as a two track system? Weight comparison?
Seems kind of like an evolution of your mast foot mount, which proved that you could have a stiff connection with two bolts in line with the mast.
Given people are breaking T nuts with a standard 4-point system I wonder if that could be an issue here.
Appletree makes their own boxes and tracks, so not surprising they are ahead of the game here.
How is this an improvement? Seems like more stress on the mast and the box? Almost looks like punching shear would come into play without insane reinforcement.
The connection on the other end of the mast is what needs the attention😂
Thanks Kyle.
Makes me love my Cedrus masts even more haha. Adaptable to any future change for a small fee.
We figured out the connection on the other end. Not a single problem with the evolution adapter interface since introduction over 2 years ago at this event. The industry is not going to standardize a foil connection. We wouldn’t be investing in Cedrus if we felt there was even a chance of this. In fact it becomes more clear every year that brands are going to keep going their own direction, and that’s honestly what makes this all so fun.
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Glad you find that fun. I imagine nicely challenging to design new adapter etc.
From the end user point of view, not having a single standard is a real pain
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I also think that the reduction in drag could be really beneficial. I noticed it with the thumbscrews were a disaster for high-speed touchdowns and paddle ups on the downwind board.
Big question - can you shim these things?
Hmmm…not excited at all, but open to hearing how this might be worth it.
In the meantime, this seems like exactly the kind of thing that pisses me off, a whole new standard that is not compatible with (much of) your current gear, requiring you to replace it…and for what exactly? I’m not seeing what problems this is solving for me…
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Faster setup, less drag, less weight penalty because the foil box and mast components are smaller.
This is exciting but it looks like a lot less side to side structural support? Is the connection conical?
Generic recorded the demo they showed us when we walked up.
I did ask about weight and they said it was about the same. The guys at the Appletree booth said the benefit is that you can pack all the stiffness you want into the track and board. At the same time, you eliminate the T-Joint on the mast which is where we see a lot of mast failures. Theoretically, if every board and mast manufacturer switched to this I could see the possibility of getting masts thinner for all of us. It would be rad if 13mm became the norm. However, that’s a huge undertaking/shift and they are saying 2027 at the earliest if lots of brands jump in.
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