Some random stuff based on observations. Wondered if any of this resonates?
Prone
a new board will feel better than an old board, this due to the rigidity going in the old board more than anything else
your prone abilities are limited by your surf abilities. You are unlikely to prone better than you can surf (generally speaking, but applies more to someone who committed surfer before)
offshore and glassy is more fun than onshore and mushy, and as soon as your skill progression starts to slow down, this becomes very apparent
a pro can make anything work and should be wary of basing your decisions on their decisions, and they are looking for something very different to what you should be looking for (james casey on the 899 really drove this home for me)
equally, mediocre riders have endless variety of dysfunctions, and anyone giving advice is probably unable to truly understand all the variables at play, and so is making a few jumps in logic to get to their opinion (speaking from my experience here where I’ve gone back on things I’ve said)
Wing
You can wing in more marginal conditions than you can windsurf/kitesurf, meaning you’ll try wing in places with shitty wind and end up in the same position, waiting on the beach, stuck offshore, getting washed up over a big shorebreak with a pile of expensive rapidly depreciating gear
The wings are near disposable and seemingly magnetised towards stabs
Downwind is incredibly sensitive to absolutely every variable, and getting ideal conditions to learn pretty much requires full commitment, and in some places it just won’t be worth the effort, or even viable at all.
Logistics of downwind requires a traffic free road running parallel to the sea to really be worth the effort, and a crew of 3 who can drop everything to make it happen on standby at all times.
The payoff can be worthwhile, and in some places incredible
Weather is complex and anywhere that doesn’t have daily see breeze, or a trade-wind setup or something unique to make it viable (Lochs in Scotland, Gorge, inland seas etc). If your local wind changes direction all the time, it will probably be a bit shit.
Very good stuff, i would disagree about the winging part. I learned to lightwind wing in flatwater after 100 sessions, also 50 sessions on a windsurf, and i can do the basics. But i have found none of it applies to prone surf foiling. Winging is like 80% sailing and 20% riding the foil, maybe cuz im always on the 8m. Nowadays I think I prefer to dockstart instead of winging as I need to work on becoming like Mr. B. I used the FD to learn how to pump flatwater on the 40L board and for me personally that was alot more rewarding and made me closer to my end goals.
Another point that I have found as im currently in the good beginner phase that has a good amount of experience surfing shortboard. I am towing 90% of the time and I am on the 650 KJ2 90% of the time. All it needs is a good 2ft+ wave. I really feel the small foil makes riding waves and even towing behind the boat alot easier than bigger foils, even 900 feels way too big. When Im on a wave, i’m able to draw lines very similar to surfing on a shortboard. Nowadays, I really look at the wave the same on a 650 foil as I do on a shortboard. Its unbelievable to me as I never thought i would look at the wave the same, but the small foil makes it super easy. I really feel like there is no point in surfing waves with anything bigger than the 650, it just makes things awkward and significantly harder. I know you draw different lines and stay away from the peak a bit more and its a different skillset, especially since I started towing waves on an 1100. But now that I got the feeling and used to the 650, I really cant go back. Less feels like its alot more. Think about it, a surfboard has a 0-sized foil, so the closest thing u can go to surfing is the smallest foil.
My conundrum about all of this, which probably is obvious to everyone else, is what to do about prone foiling. MY current best is a 2-min / 5-wave linkup in 2-3ft, and I was on the 1250 for the first time. Pretty proud of myself to do that, but I dont see myself ever pumping and linking a wave on the 650, maybe not even the 800. The best I could do is probably 1 wave link on the 950. Which would feel like a boat compared to the 650. Meaning I dont really get any pleasure from riding the 950. So the way Im looking at things is, prone is only for when you can’t tow. Or prone is mainly like a pump-fest to see how many waves you can link, its not about surfing like Mr. B. Rather, Its just to prove to yourself and maybe show off a bit in the lineup how long you can pump and link and do some basic carves.
I know ill get better as I used to love the 1100 for towing waves, but man after getting a taste of the 650, its so much easier and feels so much better. Like you have to stay closer to the pocket just like surfing, and that’s the way it should be.
Yes winging in under 15 knots is completely terrible and for me has been a waste of time. 8m conditions sounds terrible. 5m or under and in waves is super fun.
Yesterday I asked a jetski at the backline if he could tow me into a wave. First time towing. Nice big overhead swell. He said yes. Addition to the list:
There are some variables that may make DW hard in some locations. But I think it’s much more accessible than most think.
It’s more a case of how bad you want to learn.
We get very light inconsistent conditions all summer and with the correct equipment DWing is more than achievable.
Drop a bike, wing upwind and pack up, do a shorter send and walk back.
I kind of believe in 90% of situations that it doesn’t matter the discipline. If you want to learn bad enough and will work hard for it you will find a way.
Wing point #1, depends on what you consider marginal. In gusty, shitty, weird directions - yes winging is much better than kiting. But if you consider LIGHT wind (6-15kts), I’d MUCH rather be on a kite foil than a wing foil.
@FoilTheGreatLakes yup I’m about to start the DW journey, and I’m fully prepared to bicycle shuttle or even just paddle back upwind on shorter runs and get some exercise. It’s going to suck but hey… gotta do it.
Yeah I meant it’s either U ride small foils like Bennett’s but can’t pump and link. Or you ride medium foils that can pump and link, but turn way slower. After getting a taste of 650, I don’t want to go any bigger, loses all the surf feeling when you can get closer to the pocket.
I was thinking, does anyone just ride tiny foils and paddle back to the lineup like surfers. Or do foilers try to find spots where you can walk back to the starting point like wategos. In Fiji I have the advantage of having a longboat and captain that can pick me up at the end of the wave and then take me back to the lineup.
I feel like that is the reality of foiling. It’s simply not possible to be linking waves non stop for 10 minutes while ripping like Mr.B. it’s more like you have to choose between being like Camjordan and Mr.B. Both amazing in their own way, but you can’t simply combine the pump of Cam with the rip of Mr.B.
Which is why prone foiling and thinking you’re gonna ripping like Mr B is not a reality. But it does become a reality when your towing.
I got into foiling to get away from crowds and ride unsurfable waves. I am an old desk jockey, long time surfer, still struggling with my pumping and paddling back to the peak but just mainly enjoy the glide and getting some extremely long rides that I wouldn’t have gotten on a surfboard. Still working on my pumping occasionally have a breakthrough but hopefully will get it soon. One side benefit is the local foiling community.
Definitely love both styles, and I’d still be a happy foiler if I had to paddle back out after every wave. But if I could base my style on anyone it would be Pedigo or Erik. Bigger foils, more cruisy and relaxed, linking waves etc. Like watching magic.
Sure, it’s a thing. I do it after most waves. Used to do it way more when I exclusively rode the lift ha90 and before that lift surf 150v2. Prioritizing surfing in the pocket over pumping. It’s just phases you go through.
Lots of long pumping going on at wategos and in fact it is necessary to line up a great ride.
It all just takes time and an ambition to go smaller all the time and keep pushing the pump skills.
After 6 years of surf foiling to me the very best part of foiling is still pumping into a bomb way out, that I couldn’t have taken off on, and gliding into a tight turn. Sure there are the very rare long foil waves that don’t require pumping to set them up but they are very very rare in aus.
Drop the bike at the end point (lock it up or hide it), drive back to the start, send the run, ride back to car. Need to leave gear at the end or hide it. Lots of spots it seems to be safe to leave gear for extended periods safely (gorge, beaches, etc; depends where you live)
There are lots of Sup bike carrier/trailer/racks available. It’s not a case of having to physically hold it and ride the bike. Haven’t had to do the bike thing yet but I will eventually to get to better spots if I’m running solo.