Agree. I actually love the 3m PR and have no plans to replace it, but the long lines on the 4.3m are making my sessions harder than they need to be. Did the temporary line shortening hack and while it clearly improved the stow, the low end suffered and the wing didn’t really fly as well (wingtips were deforming), so I brought it back to stock line length. PR is a great wing in the small sizes, but the larger sizes sacrifice stow/redeploy too much for me.
I thought that my last paragraph in my message stating “But on a serious note” you can probably gather that anything above that wasn’t meant to be taken seriously… (sorry) 
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Bigger sizes have their usage-situation. just got a 5m and really happy with it. it extends teh low end range.
a hidden factor is your own armspan and how tall you are. i have a 190cm wingspan which means that i can pretty much pull in a 5m pow in one move. a friend a tad shorter has significantly smaller wingspan which makes PR and POW storing much harder than it needs to be. so no surprise, he rides BRM.
taller rider is not going to get the lines caught under the board as easy as shorter riders.
I am not sure what the big deal is with needing the double pull. With tired old shoulders i do it even though i have a big enough armspan even on my 3m PR. It in no way is detrimental to my stow and redeploy success. I very rarely have a redeploy failure with a PR 3.6 and 4.3 and it should be the same with all brands if you get a technique to suit you brand and actually practice it.
My friend returned his frigate and removed his PR’s from sale for the following reasons.
A 3.6m PR was better at pumping off the water in light winds than a 4m frigate due to how the PR can be ripped back and forth through the window and thereby generating apparent wind spikes for you to grab. Back to back same foil and board, no contest.
The Frigate has excess bar pressure disproportionate to its power making you think there is something there.
The a lines rip your hands apart.
The canopy while on shorter lines is very voluminous to pack.
Just some very counter opinions that no one warns you about. Give me a PR any day.
If anyone wishes to get going in say 10 to 12 knots then you had better make sure the PW behaves well on the beach in this light wind as most don’t because when you get on the water the effective wind could be as low as 7 or 8 knots at times and so many brands with just drop.
777 PT is probably the only PW with a canopy light enough to survive the well under 10 knot periods but i don’t know how it flies
Agree, you could say this is just a skill issue and blablabla, but if you are in the surf zone in overhead surf, the 4.3 and 5m PR are really not fun.
likewise. did you shorten them yet? i need to do that
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I agree re: 4.3m being pretty challenging in the surf. Im sure most of it comes down to skill level, but I can’t be on the water every day, want to maximize fun in my sessions, and I’m not inclined to make my life more difficult than it needs to be. Even the 3m is significantly easier and more successful for me to stow/redeploy vs the 4.3.
I did do the reversible (non permanent) shortening of my lines. Knotted the lines and larksheaded the pigtail around them, then wrapped the excess around the bar. They were shortened about 9.5”. The stow and redeploy was much easier with the shorter line length BUT I found the low end compromised a bit, and the wingtips would deform a bit while flying. I was pretty careful to shorten the lines equally, so I don’t think that was the issue, but my sense is that shortening the lines equally is an oversimplification. To retain the flying characteristics I think the bridle (and line length) needs to be designed differently. I experimented with it, but ultimately reversed the modification back to stock because I preferred how the sail flew that way.
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Have 2.4 and 3.6M PR’s. Sold the 4.3M as there was little advantage over the 3.6. The 4.3M was a blast to rip around on but stowing was too much trouble. Sold it to an even bigger guy and I’m a 201cm arm span and 100Kg all up. Your conditions may dictate larger but I’d rather do something else or use my DW board and a big foil than have anything larger than a 4M with very light fabric.
I’d even rather pump up a 4.5 wing 
What’s the wind range you’re flying that 3.6m in?
My 4m F-One Quest has arrived! Timed it brilliantly with an incoming cyclone swell/winds in Sydney so not sure it will be the best testing grounds for it this weekend.
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Eleveight Chute parawing “coming in April”.
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@Foilways, I’m super happy with the 3.6M Ozone PR. The best all around size for my weight and conditions. The short answer is about 14-30 knots. Ideal is about 25 Kn on an 82L 6’ x 19 board and Code 860R. Of course you can assure an easier restart on the light end with an 8’ downwind board and a big foil but I rarely do it anymore.
Thanks. I’m 82kg and I’m thinking I want to ride a 75 or 85L board. I normally wing a 55L and 65L. I do have a DW board but I would only use that on occassion.
I plan to have two parawings. So likely a 4.3m and 3.6M. Or a 4.3m and a 3m. Currently my usual conditions are 10-18 knots. But that’s just for flatwater practice. The good swell days are 25-50 knots. But the season is over for those. We won’t see that until October at least. We will see some 20 knot flatwater days tho.
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Id go 4.3 / 3. I have that same gap and it feels like it maximizes wind range while having a little bit of overlap.
I would hold only get 4m+ for now
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Right. I’m just thinking ahead. Thanks.
yeah i got the 5.7 hybrid, compared to the 5.4 skin, the upwind angle is a million times better. we are talking as good as a handwing now, before with the 5.4 skin, it was hard to get back to the place i started if i fell and spent alot of time untangling lines, etc… i always had to get the local kitesurfing boats to pick me up, but with the hybrid, i went so far up wind on just one lap i went places i never been before since i picked up parawinging, its not just a little better, it makes the skins upwind feel garbage in comparison. there are some downsides, like its not as nimble, jibing is harder, etc.. but all of those issues are nothing compared to the trade off, its like riding a MA front wing compared to a DW 13AR front wing, yeah the DW is gonna be harder to ride, but its 10x better if youre talking about performance.
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I just did the same (sold my 5.4 Skin and other PWs - bought 5.7 and 4.3 Hybrid).
To get the hybrid to turn, its a much different technique - on the Triple Seven YouTube page, there is a video where Al shows how “bank” the double skin PT. Pushing the bar (while it has line tension) in the opposite direction you want to turn and then twisting makes the hybrid turn much faster than the “brake and twist” method that works for most single skin PWs that fly off the front lines.
I also find the Hybrid down turns (jibes) way easier than any single skin I’ve used to date.
I had a pre-order in for the Vayu Pyro - but I’m so glad I got the Hybrids instead
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please show me a video of how to properly do the jibe on a hybrid, the only way i got the jibe was to simply fly the kite from 11 to 1, but it needs some wind, i cant do a ultra light wind jibe yet even on the skin ( i still am mainly using the 7.3 for light wind, tho i have the 7.2 hybrid on order)
Handling the P.T. / Double surface parawing
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Handling the P.T. / Double surface parawing |
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ok so its basically just the 11-1 o clock movement, not the traditional more fancy parawing jibes that are shown usually, thats what i thought also.