tbh u couldnt have asked for more from code, 16ar, 80cm tails. the only question is, will it be worth paying $2k for a new foil and tail when you are already riding orcas. does that extra 4AR counter the thicker fuse, non mono-bloc tail. Personally, im hesitant about shelling out more dough given i have the orcas. had they come out with this sooner, i wouldnt see the need to go f4
In addition to the fuse, the new Code mast is presumably still significantly more drag and worse turning than F4 offering.
You also have the hammerhead from F4 for even better lift to drag, though would like to see larger options.
I agree with your first point. The code mast is made to handle their huge kanga wings as well and the F4 masts are tailored for the much smaller perfomance range. The problem with taking the hammerhead to bigger sizes just worsens the problems of thin super high aspect wing design. I am sure the brands that offer these kind of wings in larger sizes had to make alot of tradeoffs.
I’m ok with some tradeoff in larger sized foils, I want the system optimized for the smaller foils. I also don’t mean huge hammerhead but one to two larger sizes if possible. HH688 is going to be small for short fetch conditions or super low wind runs I think. Though one may argue to just go to a bigger Orca.
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You should try it. The size sounds scary .
I have some clients that swapped from code and Armstrong. Riding code 860/960R and the other on HA 880 learning to Parawing DW.
They changed code guy to 688HH and the other Armstrong guy to a 585HH on SR masts.
Total success as beginners learning to DW, getting much longer runs with more ease.
This is not a head to head size comparison. Just interesting fact around the sizing and their ease of use and fun factor for these individuals.
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It burns me to say it, but for the high aspect race foils, area is a terrible measurement for comparison
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More leading edge more lift!
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Yup, understand they should have way more range and is largely why I’m interested. I tend to do very long sends on SUP and want easy paddle up and good top end. From what I have heard from friends with them Hh688 would have lowend like 800orca which I have ridden. Would love it to have even more low end of course. But yes, I need to get onto the setup and try it. I figure the start of the season I’ll see how the landscape looks and buy a new setup. Maybe even hydrocraft will have something compelling to my usecase…
Specifically about sizing, there are light short fetch Bay days though I have ridden a buddies 1050 Orca while he borrowed my 1250r due to it being better for the conditions. Thinking HH688 may not work well for that.
Code having up to a 990 ar16 is tempting to me at least but I don’t want the relatively thick fuse and draggy mast compromise on the smaller sizes. I could even keep my old mast for big foils, but they don’t offer a fully optimized setup for small foils in my opinion.
11.9mm thick, 102mm chord, good for use with the whole span range of the R2. 1/3 the price of the SR mast. 1/2 the price of the Black mast.
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Yeah, very tempting. A few things i don’t like about it are needing an adapter which I very much don’t like to use though the new titanium ones may be ok, you still have the big fuse on code, would like shorter cord I think, and finally when code eventually puts out a skinny fuse with smaller socket that mast likely will not work with it.
Well, I think that’s a different conversation. Optimizing gear for today, vs theoretical gear that comes in a few years, is very different.
The Code Black mast comes with an adapter when you buy it, so, they clearly aren’t worried about it themselves.
IMO the thin fuse of course does matter, but likely matters dramatically less than the other components. Having spent the summer testing old Lift and Code stuff on this OO mast I can say it was a HUGE upgrade for those foils, they aren’t even in the same conversation as they were on their stock masts, and I haven’t missed the thin fuse of the AFS gear at all.
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Isn’t this what Adrian Roper has been preaching for years. It’s more about the span than surface area alone
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That was the idea with cloud ix going forward swept in design. Having more span up front for low end. Those definitely took off fast.
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If you ever have the chance to try the black mast and compare it to the one ocean give us some feedback !
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That should be easy to pull off on my end!
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I have been lucky to ride the new 590r2 and 660r2 the last few weeks.
For context : I was riding the code 680R exclusively the last 2 year from 12knots to nuking conditions
660r2 is too big for me. I can flat water start easily multiple times and pump for minutes on it.
The take off on the 590r2 is similar to the 680R. Still possible to flat water start.
I agree that the new 590R2 is the replacement of my 680R with better range It can go as slow as my 680R but it will not go as fast as the top end of 600R nuking conditions (but average pace might be better and easier to ride). I found that the foil has a pace where it’s very confortable to stay but I cannot push it to be 10-15sec faster for example. Up and over are easier than before but it’s not as easy as other brands. I can go as slow as my 680R easily.
On a run where i would be averaging 2:20/km and best km at 2:10 and worst at 2:30 on my 680R for example I’m now doing an average of 2:05/km with some sub 2:00/km and worst km at 2:10.
The new code R2 wings are not to be compared to the orca but to the hammerhead if we look at AR. I’m going as fast as my friends on hammerhead 585 when we are on the same bumps but they have a clear advantage when they are pumping between bumps or doing up and over. That’s where they gain a lot of distance on me.
We found that turning is better on the R2 vs the hammerhead but if I want to do some turns on a downwind run I would much rather ride my old 680R or an other wing.
Cheers !
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better than the rc on the f4? and but not compatible to f4?
Can you say more about this? The 680r turns better than the 590r2 at the same speed?
What are peoples experiences of parawinging the R series in general? I ride mostly weak windchop and the S series struggles to harness the energy in these weak wind bumps. Im considering getting a 960r to help. Now code has launched the R2 im wondering if that would a better foil to buy or am i just going to hold back my progression by buying a foil that is too hard to use? My main focus is learning to link bumps and cruising downwind, im not ripping turns.
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I’ve been riding predominantly the 1300S and 1250R in weak wind chop on the Chesapeake Bay. 16-28 knots usually. 1.8-2.4 ft @ 4 seconds is usually what the buoy reads out for whatever that’s worth. I was getting some pretty decent runs on both foils which I assumed were a better match to this low energy. Just switched to a 960R and holy cow is it good. It’s faster, turns better and overall just seems much more efficient to link bumps. As long as I have the wind to get up on foil I’m not sure there are any drawbacks unless the bumps are nearly nonexistent. I’m 63kg on an 80L mini dart with one ocean mast.
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