Huge thanks to everyone!! There are lots of considerations on the mast design - shape, profiles, materials, construction process etc. We design the layup for specific twist and lateral bending parameters. The skinny masts are much stiffer in torsion relative to lateral bending. However, these masts are generally softer than our windsurf or wing race masts. The short chord contributes to more looseness for high aspect wings as well as low profile and spray drag. One thing to note is the skinny mast is much more thin than others even those at 12.2mm. It doesn’t sound like much difference numerically, but the stiffness goes with the cube of the thickness, so exponentially more difficult the thinner you go!!
Does anyone have any opinions on riding the 75 vs the 85 TE mast on the Orca 685 135 stab. I have been riding a 75 cm Lift mast for quite some time. I like the responsive direct feel. Mostly riding small to medium bumps with a parawing I am wondering if I will it too short? I don’t have generally have much problem with breaching on a 75.I am lightweight at 53 kg .
I am not new to parawing downwinding (1year) but not an expert ..Lots of wingfoil downwinding.
75 and 85 TE masts are amazing and what I’ve been riding with the 685/135 wing. The mast is 75 from the bottom of the board to the top of the fuselage. If you are comfortable with this length, seems like a good option.
The parawing are coming soon, just getting the last prototypes for testing!!
I’m really happy with the 85. I’m 65kgs riding the 685 with 135xs. I moved from a 80cm Armstrong, so extra length was not as big as 10cm. The 85 really frees up dynamic 3d carves and great rail clearance when throwing it over. It’s also crucial for going upwind in steep, stacked bumps.
I squeezed a quick upwind /dw run yesterday on a post frontal 1-2 hour window of wind and on the DW run in waist high groomed bumps, I breached wing tips on several times before I finally breached at too much of a vertical angle and came down. Wind was over and I had to belly sail back to shore.
Drawback is that I’d prefer a shorter mast in the event I dust off the SUP. Also would prefer a 80cm for prone surf. So this 85 is pretty much only for PW for me. I’ll try it SUP and prone, so time will tell.
Thank you so much for your reply and excellent information here. Very appreciated. After reading your comments and hearing from another top rider I’m very happy to get the 85. I strictly parawing, no sup so the 85 will be perfect. I just ordered the same setup you’re riding and I’m very excited to get on it.
I wish you a great day and great fun in the bumps.
Based on the size of F4 as a company and the design/integration/logistics complexity other brands have reported with the integrated mast, I actually have to say I hope that the answer is no. And this is as an FD owner, with F4 well out in front atm for my my long overdue brand switch, and someone who thinks an integrated mast absolutely makes a significant difference for heavy riders.
Might be in the minority here, but I would much rather see their limited design bandwidth focus on other areas. As a heavier rider, particularly on the larger Mantas, an intermediate Orca size between 800 and 1050, 80cm mast lengths, and potentially either tuttle heads or the Radix option if that gains traction.
In general, I think the hype and performance around F4 right now is coming in no small part because they have gone after many of the incremental gains other brands have either left on the table or are just getting to now, and I would rather keep taping the FD and dealing with ventilation from the fat cable running down the back of the mast then see that focus on efficient design get diluted.
Have had a couple runs on the 1050/800 Orcas and am super pleased with what they deliver. Simply put, Orca is a surfier Code R. I loved the Code R, but they are quite spanny so found myself on the S series 99% of the time, even downwinding. But for fast moving ocean groundswell/bumps with more complexity, S series can get a bit laborious, especially in winter neoprene where optimizing for glide becomes more important. R series starts to shine here, but is much less fun to push in turns in my opinion.
The Orcas strike a balance between S/R series from code. Similar low end to R series per size, similar glide, but noticeably surfier/intuitive span for span. Mast and fuse are sleeker, faster. Got my fastest km times on my first run with the orca 800 (1:54km), in 10 lbs of neoprene in somewhat challenging, but fast conditions. probably close to 220lbs/100kg with rubber, 20-25kts.
I will most likely keep running Code S for Bay runs where cranking turns is the priority and speed/glide isn’t really a factor. I think Code X series sounds great for bay runs and lineups, so can’t wait to get a couple sizes in the X range. But for ocean runs where I want a balance of flow and speed, Orca gets the nod there. Both great brands just wanted to share some differences for those curious
I did reach out to the FD guys about an integrated mast and they’ve send all the details needed to create one. However the opportunity cost for us is pretty high especially given that the bolt on type with taping appears to work. It’s not the most elegant solution, but we would rather focus on the next generation DW and surf foils at the moment.
That’s is a strong statement and a huge recommendation. It makes sense, released two years after the Code R wing, I guess the industry has learned some things to improve it.
I’m curious about this too. Looking to switch in new year to an 800 but there seems to be infinite tail options 3 diff lengths and each size has 5 different sizes
135 xs, I think I may get the 135 small fuse when the conditions are maxing for a bit more control. But also that pitch sensitivity usually means I just need some more time learning the setup
