In San Diego, there aren’t many chances to wing foil in the surf, so we mostly ride on flat water. Lately, I’ve grown tired of just “mowing the lawn” and have started focusing on speed instead.
I’m fascinated by apparent wind, pushing speed limits, and choosing the right gear to maximize speed in light wind conditions.
I currently track my speed using a Samsung watch and the Health app, but I’d love a recommendation for a better tracking app.
I know a lot of you track your data—what setups are you using, and what kind of speeds are you hitting relative to wind speed?
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I just use the garmin instinct 2 to track my data. I think there might be better options out there but it’s enough for me.
I’m slow because while I’m winging, I’m always flagged out riding swell. I’ve ridden a ton of foils but primarily AFS right now and all my data from the last year shows I average 12-13mph. I’ve hit 20 knots a few times when trying to intentionally do so but otherwise my top speed ever was on the AFS Ultra 750 with 75cm skinny mast and ha38 tail just ripping down swell flagged out at close to 20mph.
Things that I see make my speed go up after all my data breakdowns:
Thinner masts are faster.
Thinner foils are faster.
Smaller foils are faster.
Smaller tails are faster.
Larger sails are faster. This one was interesting to me because I kinda figured I would be faster in stronger wind but I’m not really. There’s a huge change in my speed averages and high ends on flat days when I use my 3m in strong winds vs my 4m in light winds. 4m wins every time.
I use dawn patrol, but I am mostly riding waves.
I will say that I do not notice a difference in average speed relative to wind speed.
I do notice a difference depending on the setup I ride. Going down a wing size nets me an additional (average speed) MPH or two, and moving to a faster mast got me another MPH or two (and higher top speed), but again, that is not correlated to wind speed.
Makes me think the speed limitation is less wind, and moreso gear dependent, at least on the lower end of the speed spectrum (max 25 mph).
FWIW dawn patrol doesn’t show where I am hitting my max speeds - could be on the waves?
You can use “waterspeed” for tracking. It gives lots of data.
I can hit 20 for short spurts pretty regularly in a flat spot with good wind when Im overpowered or bordering on it, but I feel like getting meaningfully above that level is very hard for me. Ive probably only hit 21 a couple of times ever and those are just blips. I probably average 11-13 on most of my sessions (normalized for moving time) and I never really put any thought or effort into optimizing for speed. I think my top speeds are usually hit when bearing off downwind from a hard crosswind run.
Fastest setup I have a lot of experience on is the Silk 850 (which isn’t particularly fast) and Ozone Flux or Ocean Rodeo Glide wings.
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I’ve done a bit of speed winging, it’s fun especially if you have good flat water. I find that 20-25 knots of wind and super flat water are ideal, more wind is usually gusty and it becomes harder to keep the foil under control. Setup wise, stability is more important than the ultimate slippery setup, you need to be able to put the power down. a few years ago I was able to do 25mph on my old Axis 900 with a 19mm aluminum mast and a huge draggy stabilizer, super slow setup by todays standards but really stable.
You are in a light wind area, so a fast mid-length type board will help get going on smaller foils, a 5.5 or 6.0 and a 600-800 cm foil should get you 20knots or more in 15 knots of wind as long as you can get on foil.
You can export and upload your GPX file to gps-wingfoiling.com to output a result like this (4.5 wing, 575 cm foil, 20 knots or so wind):
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I track my rides with a garmin epix gen 2 using the windsurf activity, and that syncs to strava as well.
I max out at around 21 kts, or 24mph for a 2 second max speed. I find as long as you have enough wind, like low 20s, more wind doesn’t make me go faster on the same equipment. I’ve seen a max speed between 20.5 and 21kts on several sessions, but never higher. I’m sure a faster foil or racier wing would allow me to take advantage of higher winds.
I’m using a north ma v2 foils. I have the 1200 and 850, I assume I was using the 850 on those faster days but did not note down which I was using.
I did get the HM mast which should be faster, but I moved to the shorter fuse at the same time. The shorter fuse is more fun but less stable at high speed, so I have not seen higher max speeds since switching. If I wanted to do a speed run day I would put the longer fuse on the HM mast with the 850 wing and smaller of the stabs I have.
I’d say the board doesn’t matter much as this was all on an inflatable.
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I use the garmin instinct to track and sync to strava as well.
I rode the uni prog 125 and aluminum mast all last season and would max out around 21-22 knots. But this winter i moved to a mikeslab 700 because speed is what I have the most fun with and now I have been hitting max speeds of between 25-27. I did have one day where I hit 29.
Prone in 5-7’ point break. Hit 26 mph today according to Waterspeed/Apple Watch.
Code 720s - MED fuse - 135 Tail - NoLimitz 78cm mast w/integrated Foil Drive
Fun!
Here’s my $0.02 on speed:
I use a Garmin Instinct. Over 4 years of wing foiling I very consistently avg 12-13 knots during my sessions. Flat water slightly higher avg speed, and in waves slightly lower avg speed. Top speed is 22.5 knots, which I have achieved with ART899, SF840, and AV2-879. Though I have tried hard a few times, I have not broken this barrier.
Lately I have been riding the Skinny rear wings, a 40, 35, and even a 30. They definitely unlock some speed but have not opened up the top end as much as I would expect.
I agree with the comments about stability. I generally ride a longer fuse and smaller rear to achieve less drag and more stability. I find the platform more stable and faster while still maintaining adequate turning.
In looking at kite foils, they generally run much larger rear wings in comparison to front wing size. I think this makes the platforms quite stable while reducing overall area and particularly wingspan. Sometimes it looks like the rear is half the size of the front! So, much larger than what you generally see in wing foiling or other foiling disciplines.
I also believe wingspan equals drag. I can just feel the drag more when I go to a higher span foil. It feels quite obvious. I have learned anything over 1m span is too wide for me, no matter the wind speed. When I got my SF840 I didn’t expect it to be as fast as it is, but I was quite easily able to achieve the same top speed as my ART899. For me, I haven’t liked any foil over 1m span OR 10AR.
Certainly 22-23 knots seems like a huge barrier that I haven’t been able to break. I’m skeptical of reports from avg riders doing more than this. GPS data can be notoriously inaccurate with low quality devices.
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My top recorded speed on my Locosys GW-60 watch is 32.81 knots vmax (37.75 mph) wing foiling with a 5.7m Ozone Fusion and Chubanga V4 (530 cm2) foil.
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I also track with a garmin epix gen 2 watch using a clone if the windsurfing app. I wish it gave vmg and a few other sailing features that sailing has. I’ve done 18.8 on an axis 1310 png, std red fuse, -1.0 shim on a 362/50 skinny tail in 12-18mph winds and a 6m Cabrinha vision wing. Usual top speeds are around 15 though. I’ve done over 20mph in 15-25mph winds with a cabrinha mantis apex 5m wing, axis 1070 fireball / crazyshort adv black fuse, and 362/50 tail.
I find that 13mph is fun and I have a lot of fun not pushing speed too much, but some day I want to hit 30!
That’s impressive! How is the Chubanga foil? Is it hard to get flying?
My top so far is ~22knots, winging on a lift 90ha and 25glide. Working on going faster.
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I top out around 19 kts on Lift 90 and cruise around 13 kts on Lift 90/120/150, measured with iPhone/Waterspeed. I ride a 28” mast and it’s usually pretty choppy here so not ideal for going fast. It feels like almost everyone rides Mikes lab zoom zoom foils here at Crissy and I’m usually the slowest on the water, I definitely notice it on long upwind runs. If I really squeeze I can keep up with someone who’s just casually cruising upwind. 
Chubanga makes an awesome foil. Arguably the fastest foil made. The V4 (530cm2) does require a lot of board speed to get foiling but the more you ride smaller foils the easier it gets. I’m 54 years old and weigh 235 lbs and by no means an elite athlete. I do not need high winds to comfortably ride the V4. The V4 is a kite racing foil with a short fuselage. So it’s a bit tricky at first but again the more you ride it the more comfortable you get.
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Buddy 2 days ago hit 24 knots yesterday coming in small waves spot speed runs on Sk8 550 and 3.5, 14mm F-one mast. About 1 knot faster than on the 650 he usually rides.
Another buddy does over 40 knots on Chumbanga and kirefoil. His average is usually twice mine wingfoiling in the same conditions.
I’ve done 26 knots Gong Ypra-Surf-Freestyles 800 3.5 flat water, Cedrus Evolution wind.
Generally in waves 12-14 knots cruising.
Around 18-20 knots +/- flagging down waves on various Gong foils, above that I don’t feel I have fast/young enough reflexes.
I appreciate everyone who contributed to this thread!
I was able to track down a Levitaz R5 race foil.
I’m currently looking for a Tuttle-mount board for winging—if you have one available, please DM me.
I also discovered Sailsync.ai, which lets me upload my .GPX files for sailing feedback. It even provides time-synced telemetry overlays for drone footage!
My Current top run: 30.7 mph in ~22 mph wind on Mission Bay, San Diego.
Setup:
- Board: Proper 80L (6ft x 18.5" x 5.25")
- Mast: No Limitz V2 85
- Foil: Lift 90
- Stab: Glide 25
- Wing: PPC M1 5m
- Weight: 193 lbs
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Very nice! Congrats on the Levitaz. I will be curious to hear how it compares with the 90ha…
I recently made it out to the coast and was surprised by just how fast I got going on a wave. The same setup I normally use to ride short period wind swell (Armstrong 1325, Cedrus Evo Surf) will top out around 19kts powered up with a wing hit 21.6kts wave riding. Just shy of the fastest I’ve gone with a wing (22kts) on the 725.
That has me wondering, when brands give an estimated speed range for a foil obviously the low speed is the stall speed for some typical weight rider, but how do they decide on a top speed number, and do they determine it in the same way?
This conversation could lead to a deeper dive into Speed Over Ground (SOG) vs. Speed Through Water (STW).
For example, if you’re winging in a channel or river with a 4-knot current pushing you along with the wind, how fast are you actually going?
Another key consideration is how often your GPS device records speed—is it every 2 seconds or every 4 seconds? And how long do you need to sustain a speed for it to be considered valid?
I’ve noticed that some of my highest recorded speeds—ones that exceed my personal record—are followed by crashes. I personally disregard those speeds as bad data in my own tracking, but it raises an interesting question about how to define and verify top speeds.
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